How Brain Energy Shapes Health: Computational Neuroscience in Action with Dr. Jin Hyung Lee, Ph.D.

1
00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:06,240
Welcome to the Let's Talk Brain
Health podcast, a public health

2
00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:08,920
educational initiative of the
virtual Brain Health Center.

3
00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,240
I'm your host, Doctor Crystal
Color, and I'm so glad you're

4
00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:14,880
here.
On this podcast, I sit down with

5
00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:18,240
incredible guests to explore all
things brain health and

6
00:00:18,240 --> 00:00:20,520
Wellness.
Together, we'll talk about how

7
00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:24,440
to care for your total brain
health, mind, body, and spirit

8
00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:28,160
while sharing the latest brain
Health Science practical tips

9
00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:30,720
and strategies you can use every
day.

10
00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:34,240
By prioritizing your brain
health, you're taking an

11
00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:37,320
important step towards living a
happier, healthier life.

12
00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:40,560
So let's dive in and welcome
today's guest.

13
00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:45,520
We'd like to welcome Doctor Jin
Lee, a visionary neuroscientist,

14
00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:50,120
Stanford professor, and founder
of Elvis Corporation.

15
00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:54,800
That's LVIS.
Doctor Lee's groundbreaking

16
00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:58,960
technology, Neuro Match, is
revolutionizing brain healthcare

17
00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,920
by creating a digital twin of
brain function, a live

18
00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:06,400
interactive model that reveals
how brain circuits communicate

19
00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:09,720
in real time.
This is not only a technological

20
00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:12,760
breakthrough, but it's critical
step towards addressing the

21
00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:16,920
rising prevalence of neurologic
disorders like epilepsy, autism,

22
00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:19,560
and Alzheimer's.
Jen, is there anything else you

23
00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:21,880
would like to comment about your
background or share with our

24
00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:24,360
audience?
Yeah, that's a really nice

25
00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:25,960
summary.
But one thing I would like to

26
00:01:25,960 --> 00:01:29,160
share is that I didn't start off
as a neuroscientist.

27
00:01:29,160 --> 00:01:31,880
I was trained as an electrical
engineer all the way through my

28
00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:37,040
PhD, but I decided to jump into
neuroscience when my grandmother

29
00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:40,680
had a stroke.
Jen, welcome to the podcast and

30
00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:44,240
thank you so much for sharing
your personal connection to the

31
00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:48,400
broader brain health base.
So that was my initial question

32
00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:50,720
after watching some of your Ted
Talks.

33
00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:54,720
And I hope our guests will check
out our show notes below where

34
00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:57,480
they can see some of the tops
from your labs page.

35
00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:02,440
Because you posed the question,
can we fix the brain like we fix

36
00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:06,720
electronic circuits?
And that got me thinking, how

37
00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:11,240
does electrical engineering
intersect with brain health?

38
00:02:11,640 --> 00:02:14,560
Would you mind telling us a
little bit about that and your

39
00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:18,560
work and what inspired you to
create Neuro Match in your

40
00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:21,640
research today?
Yeah, I'd be very happy to.

41
00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,840
When I first learned about brain
disorders was when my

42
00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:29,400
grandmother had a stroke and one
day she had a stroke and she was

43
00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:33,800
just paralyzed on the right side
of her body and she remained bed

44
00:02:33,800 --> 00:02:37,840
bound for about 12 years.
And as she was going through all

45
00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:41,240
the rehabilitation therapy, I
was wondering why there's

46
00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:43,840
nothing we can do to directly
fix the brain.

47
00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:47,960
Where what I started to learn is
that the brain is actually an

48
00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:51,000
electronic circuit in a way
because it uses electrical

49
00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:54,240
signal to communicate, it forms
a circuit.

50
00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:57,640
That's a well known fact.
Once I learned that, my thought

51
00:02:57,640 --> 00:03:02,000
next went to why can't we just
directly analyze the circuit,

52
00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:05,960
see how it should operate
normally, and when there is a

53
00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:09,240
disorder that's disrupting its
normal function, why can't we

54
00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:12,040
simply restore it based on that
simple idea?

55
00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:15,120
I started going around asking
questions and there was no tool

56
00:03:15,120 --> 00:03:20,640
available to be able to do that.
I decided, you know what, maybe

57
00:03:20,640 --> 00:03:23,400
this is something I can do as an
electrical engineer.

58
00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:26,280
So I decided to take on that
journey.

59
00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:30,720
So in my lab for the past 15
years, we've been doing research

60
00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:33,360
on trying to model the brain
function.

61
00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:38,200
And once we had the ability to
quantitatively model the brain

62
00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:42,880
function, we then moved on to
translating that solution to a

63
00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:45,640
form that's deliverable in a
clinic.

64
00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:49,120
That is what the origin of
neural matches.

65
00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:53,600
Jen probably didn't know that I
am an adult neurologist, so I've

66
00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:56,640
been doing that in that
especially for 26 years.

67
00:03:56,640 --> 00:04:00,080
And I did neurophysiology
training way back many years

68
00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:01,840
ago.
But the reason I'm even

69
00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:04,280
mentioning this because
electrical engineering is

70
00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:08,480
definitely a key about how well
I actually got into neurology.

71
00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:11,400
Given that there are a lot of
diseases, a lot of the

72
00:04:11,400 --> 00:04:15,200
neurodegenerative diseases that
are just going to increase over

73
00:04:15,200 --> 00:04:18,560
the next 20 years because of the
aging population, and that

74
00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:22,240
includes Parkinson's and
Alzheimer's disease.

75
00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:27,160
How might technologies like
Neuromatch help reduce personal

76
00:04:27,160 --> 00:04:29,720
and societal costs?
Yeah.

77
00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:32,520
So I'm thinking about it in
multiple different angles.

78
00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:36,880
For one, if you have the ability
to understand which part of the

79
00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:41,320
neural circuit is damaged when
you have neurological disorders,

80
00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:43,480
there are ways to directly
reverse that.

81
00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,440
And on top of that, once you
have that ability to look at

82
00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:51,600
things, the circuitry and their
functions, you can then also do

83
00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:55,120
preventative care where we can
start to monitor the brain

84
00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,720
health.
If it starts to deteriorate, you

85
00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:02,040
can tune it.
Fixing the circuit damage once

86
00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:05,640
it reaches beyond a certain
stage is much more difficult

87
00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:09,200
compared to being able to tune
it at an earlier stage.

88
00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:12,960
What I'm envisioning is that
everybody will really start to

89
00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:17,560
monitor their own brain health
and take charge of taking care

90
00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:20,920
of your brain health.
And if you happen to discover it

91
00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:24,920
in a much later stage, having
the ability to understand what

92
00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:29,880
exactly needs to be reversed
also gives you a direct answer

93
00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:32,280
to what therapeutic should be
designed.

94
00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:36,080
Can you go into a little detail
about what neuro match actually

95
00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:38,280
is?
Actually how it works, how it

96
00:05:38,280 --> 00:05:39,880
functions.
Yeah.

97
00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:44,280
So Neural Match, we designed it
around providing a tool that can

98
00:05:44,280 --> 00:05:48,000
be used in a clinical setting to
visualize the brain network

99
00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:50,360
function.
Right now, there's very little

100
00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:52,560
you can do in the clinical
setting.

101
00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:57,200
We utilized in particular EEG,
because that's a very deployable

102
00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:00,440
technology.
It's been around for many years.

103
00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:03,960
But interpreting EEG is very
difficult because it comes from

104
00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:07,360
a very complex signal.
There's a lot of noise and it's

105
00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,240
also unclear what the signal
means.

106
00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:13,760
In my lab we have developed over
the years ways to understand the

107
00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:18,480
signal by directly doing cell
type specific neuromodulations,

108
00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:21,920
mapping them, where we now have
a good understanding of how

109
00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:25,480
single cell spikes interact with
the overall brain network.

110
00:06:25,840 --> 00:06:30,000
Using that information, we
started to try to interpret how

111
00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:33,520
human brain function that's
measured from very noisy signal

112
00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:36,160
can be interpreted.
And now what we have is a

113
00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:40,280
solution where we can start to
map different symptoms in the

114
00:06:40,280 --> 00:06:42,600
patients to be directly
visualized.

115
00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:47,480
And sometimes I look at the data
when they have certain anxiety

116
00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:52,560
attacks or even have epileptic
seizure or having some

117
00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:56,960
depression symptoms or autistic
symptoms, we can start to parse

118
00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:59,880
out those symptoms.
And then when we see which part

119
00:06:59,880 --> 00:07:03,080
of the circuitry is having
malfunction that you can start

120
00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:06,400
to treat them, that is the basic
idea.

121
00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:09,760
And we're starting to see great
success in that direction.

122
00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:13,400
So is there an electrical
signature of a person having a

123
00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:19,080
panic attack or a depressive
episode or as other type of mood

124
00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:22,440
related issue?
Yeah, we're starting to see that

125
00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:26,000
where we've done research on it,
but I wasn't sure if we're gonna

126
00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:29,560
really be able to decipher it
from an EEG signal, but we're

127
00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:31,520
starting to see that those are
possible.

128
00:07:31,840 --> 00:07:37,520
We're gonna start to be able to
tell in specific individuals

129
00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:38,960
whether you're having this
attack.

130
00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:42,120
Is this a direct result of your
brain function circuit changes?

131
00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:45,440
Can we modify these circuit
changes so that you no longer

132
00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,040
have attacks?
That would be the way that you

133
00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:51,720
would imagine how neuromatch
will change the way we deal with

134
00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:55,280
brain disorders.
How do you see this playing into

135
00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:58,960
some of the bigger initiatives
and the broader landscape of

136
00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:02,720
what we're seeing in the shift
of better understanding the

137
00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:07,000
brain, neuroscience and its
inner working, so to speak,

138
00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:10,760
where we hear efforts like the
US Brain Initiative, the Human

139
00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:13,920
Brain Research Project.
Does this support and or help

140
00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:17,280
accelerate your work?
My work has been directly

141
00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:19,680
inspired by both projects you
mentioned.

142
00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:23,240
Because the US Brain Initiative
funded a lot of my research in

143
00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:26,080
the lab.
We have directly benefited from

144
00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:28,800
such programs.
The Human Brain project was a

145
00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,520
European project, so we were not
directly involved in it.

146
00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:35,400
But the goal of the project of
what I intended to do with my

147
00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:39,760
research and what they set out
to do, model brain function, was

148
00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:42,799
an identical goal.
And inspired that by that

149
00:08:42,799 --> 00:08:47,200
project, we also made separate
efforts on how we think the

150
00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:51,640
brain should be modeled and it
has resulted in fairly

151
00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:55,320
successful outcome, which is
what we translated into a neuro

152
00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:58,560
match.
From the work that you have been

153
00:08:58,560 --> 00:09:03,280
doing, what do you see about the
power of collaboration and this

154
00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:07,680
intersection of science,
engineering and medicine and

155
00:09:07,680 --> 00:09:12,160
pushing brain research forward,
as well as the supplied science

156
00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:16,720
piece and supporting patients
and healthcare providers in that

157
00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:19,760
day-to-day life?
Talking about my own personal

158
00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,960
journey, I was a straight up
electrical engineer all the way

159
00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:27,520
through my PhD and then I jumped
head on into neuroscience

160
00:09:27,560 --> 00:09:32,200
research, very basic science in
my lab as I became a professor.

161
00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:37,040
And then afterwards, once we had
enough clues about it, we went

162
00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:41,080
into developing clinical
solutions that is suited for a

163
00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:43,920
clinical setting.
It was a very long journey,

164
00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:47,040
jumping through lots of
different cultural differences,

165
00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:50,120
but along the way we've
collaborated with all the

166
00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:52,960
different experts in these
fields, which is what made it

167
00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:55,600
possible.
And to solve a problem like

168
00:09:55,680 --> 00:09:59,000
brain disorders, there's no
other way than being able to

169
00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:00,720
work with a lot of different
experts.

170
00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:04,800
So I'm very grateful for all the
people that provided amazing

171
00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,480
collaboration and we intend to
move forward in the same

172
00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:11,120
direction.
I have a question about this.

173
00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:15,280
From doing some patient advocacy
work as well and just seeing

174
00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:20,000
this broad stroke of when we
talk about brain health, it's

175
00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:23,320
really become much more
expansive to people living with

176
00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:27,880
brain based conditions, whether
it's neurodegenerative or living

177
00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:29,720
with a mental health condition
as well.

178
00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:33,640
I think the latest stats from
the Dana Foundation say 8 out of

179
00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:37,200
10 people are impacted directly
by a brain health condition,

180
00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,960
whether they're diagnosed or
someone in their immediate

181
00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:44,080
network.
How do you work with involving

182
00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:47,280
patients and kind of some of
your design or how they may be

183
00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:51,000
influencing what's next, whether
it's for them or their own loved

184
00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:53,800
ones?
That's a great question.

185
00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:57,120
As I was going through this
journey of jumping into

186
00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:00,680
neuroscience for the past 15
years, one of the things that

187
00:11:00,680 --> 00:11:04,960
was I wish everything was faster
where I want to help this person

188
00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:09,160
who has this parent who has
Alzheimer's as a kid with

189
00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:12,960
autism, it was very difficult to
say, well, this research will

190
00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:16,080
take another decade before you
can benefit.

191
00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,800
But fortunately now we're seeing
results.

192
00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,560
We have FDA approved solutions
that can be immediately deployed

193
00:11:23,560 --> 00:11:26,640
into clinical use.
And now that we have that and we

194
00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:31,120
directly see patient data, the
discovery process is actually

195
00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:35,600
accelerated in a way, seeing
people in need directly.

196
00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:38,160
You're right, 8 out of 10.
I'm surprised it's not ten out

197
00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:41,960
of 10 because if I go ask
anybody, ask if they have a

198
00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:44,920
family member or friend who's
impacted, is it impacting you?

199
00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:47,840
It's almost everyone when I meet
them.

200
00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:51,720
And then I have a chance to look
at their brain network and then

201
00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:55,440
start to analyze it.
Then the discoveries accelerated

202
00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:57,640
also through the personal
connections.

203
00:11:57,640 --> 00:12:00,320
I feel really motivated to do do
this faster.

204
00:12:00,680 --> 00:12:05,160
So it has been a really positive
experience where instead of

205
00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:09,160
taking an approach of, oh, this
is how we should do it

206
00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:10,600
systematically, this is the
plan.

207
00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:12,760
It's more, Oh my God, we need to
address this right now.

208
00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:16,600
Let's just get on it.
It's both been hectic, but also

209
00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:20,960
exciting and motivating to be
able to help people in an

210
00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:23,520
accelerated manner.
Not where I have to tell them,

211
00:12:23,560 --> 00:12:26,000
I'll come back in 10 years,
let's see what I can do for you.

212
00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:30,040
Let's try this right now.
So it's been exciting.

213
00:12:30,560 --> 00:12:34,440
Yes, Jim, everybody's talking
about artificial intelligence in

214
00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:37,000
the last several years,
especially this year.

215
00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:41,880
And it sounds like just what I
know basically about Neuromatch

216
00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:45,840
and they're using a lot of data
sets, a lot of energy.

217
00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:52,280
And I was just curious how that
plays into this being more

218
00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:56,520
democratic product that's used
in many clinics and just the

219
00:12:56,520 --> 00:13:00,560
amount of power that has to be
used to analyze people's

220
00:13:00,560 --> 00:13:03,040
information.
Have you thought about that or?

221
00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:06,120
That's a great question.
Thank you so much for asking

222
00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:09,000
that question.
There are two main aspects

223
00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:11,760
related to energy and
availability.

224
00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:16,640
One is the brain signal as it
stands in the current clinical

225
00:13:16,640 --> 00:13:20,440
setting, as you are very well
aware, is there only a few

226
00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,200
number of physicians who can
even read it.

227
00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:27,160
Access to brain health
assessment is very limited.

228
00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:30,400
That's not something that can be
widely deployed.

229
00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:33,960
There are care deserts, so to
speak, even in the United

230
00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:37,480
States, where there's more
healthcare than other places,

231
00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:40,120
one would argue.
And these deserts can be taken

232
00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:44,680
care of because we basically use
AI to solve human intelligence

233
00:13:44,680 --> 00:13:47,320
problems.
A lot of things are automated.

234
00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:51,200
It's very easily deployable in a
very energy efficient manner.

235
00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:55,720
So it could be deployed in very
limited settings in a very

236
00:13:55,960 --> 00:13:58,280
scalable manner.
That's one thing.

237
00:13:58,560 --> 00:14:03,160
Another aspect regarding energy
is that we started this journey

238
00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:07,960
because we wanted to solve brain
disorders, But in the process,

239
00:14:07,960 --> 00:14:10,920
what we are doing is
understanding how brain circuit

240
00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:14,480
algorithms work and it does
computation in a very different

241
00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:18,480
manner compared to regular
electronics, which is what we

242
00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:22,720
use for AI nowadays.
And the problem with that AI is

243
00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:26,480
that it is AI working for AI,
not really AI working for

244
00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:28,880
humans.
Because for one, look at all the

245
00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:32,480
data center and the energy that
it's taking up, we often find

246
00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:34,680
ourselves where it's like a
matrix.

247
00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:39,880
We're giving all the energy to
the AI to do it's AI thing while

248
00:14:39,880 --> 00:14:42,680
we have to conserve energy to
where we don't have enough

249
00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,360
electricity to power air
conditioning, for example.

250
00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:50,960
But having an energy efficient
AI is a very important way to

251
00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:56,480
make sure that AI serves humans
instead of us working to give

252
00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:58,920
energy to AI and the human
brain.

253
00:14:58,920 --> 00:15:02,720
One of the key features is that
it is highly energy efficient.

254
00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:06,920
And as we are looking at the
algorithms of how the brain

255
00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:10,000
computes, we're starting to
understand that this is very

256
00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:14,360
different from the way that the
regular von Neumann architecture

257
00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:18,720
computer computes things.
And as we learn this to cure

258
00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,200
brain disorders, we're also
learning that this can be

259
00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:25,240
utilized to design energy
efficient computational systems.

260
00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:29,720
And that's another way where
we're using AI to solve human

261
00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:34,400
brain problems, but we're using
human brain insights to solve AI

262
00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:38,320
problems.
I was just curious, has any data

263
00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:42,480
center company come up to you
given your research saying, hey,

264
00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,680
this energy usage in the brain
could be modeled to improve

265
00:15:46,680 --> 00:15:51,320
energy efficiencies for other
purposes or any other AI product

266
00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:53,600
that is being created actually
right now?

267
00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:56,880
Yeah.
The AI work in terms of creating

268
00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:01,000
new computational approaches,
it's more in the earlier stages

269
00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:05,040
than the brain science part is,
but we're starting to make good

270
00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:08,440
progress there and we're doing
active research projects on it.

271
00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:12,400
I'm constantly in contact with a
lot of data center people and

272
00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:15,480
energy efficiency.
Getting good cheap source of

273
00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:19,120
energy is one of the biggest
concerns there and we are

274
00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:23,040
envisioning collaborating very
soon in order to bring some of

275
00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:27,080
these knowledge to exponentially
improve energy efficiency.

276
00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:30,840
And reflecting back on what
you've just shared, I almost

277
00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,520
feel like after our
conversation, I have to go ask

278
00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:38,320
AI to almost generate a poem of
all the things we know about the

279
00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,600
energy and the ways we use
strategies to take care of our

280
00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:45,520
brain because we've been so
overwhelmed by our environment

281
00:16:45,520 --> 00:16:47,600
that we've lost touch of those
basics.

282
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:51,360
And while we have to scramble to
put those all back in, which is

283
00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:53,440
a very long journey for John and
I.

284
00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:57,600
And our podcast is having
experts on to give us back that

285
00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:01,600
brain science and to stretch the
importance of the lifestyle.

286
00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:04,599
And it seems like what you're
talking was saying too, is we're

287
00:17:04,599 --> 00:17:07,440
going to have this balance where
the technology is informing the

288
00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:09,640
brain and then we're using the
brain to inform.

289
00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:13,160
And I feel like our brain could
write a poem to a yes, we're.

290
00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:19,319
Going to make that happen.
Of being energy efficient, but

291
00:17:19,319 --> 00:17:22,160
just the things that it's
learned and how the demands it

292
00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:26,040
is and just your work of the
intersection of the engineering

293
00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,040
and the problems you're trying
to solve.

294
00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:32,160
But I think better understand
that and the conversations that

295
00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:35,040
we're probably going to have
towards the end of today of what

296
00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:40,160
are we doing to keep our brains
energy center to doing the best

297
00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:42,160
it can.
And just like you talked there

298
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,600
with the old when we start to
reach there, how do we make sure

299
00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,840
we don't go past it or at least
had to dial it back to reach our

300
00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:52,920
day-to-day lives.
Been excited to ask you this

301
00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:57,720
question now about what's the
role that you see neuromax

302
00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:02,680
playing in improving this area
of diagnosis and treatment for

303
00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:05,760
some of the conditions you
mentioned earlier like dementia,

304
00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:08,360
autism or epilepsy and your
current work?

305
00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:12,960
A couple of different things.
For one, we live in a day and

306
00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:17,040
age where there's so many things
coming at us, where a lot of us

307
00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:22,040
are in either mental health or
neurological disorder kicking

308
00:18:22,360 --> 00:18:25,720
our ass, where a lot of us also
have sleep problems.

309
00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:28,960
That's another problem with your
brain, all of that.

310
00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,640
I think we can now enter a new
era.

311
00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:34,200
There's all these machines
coming at us with all the

312
00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:37,680
stimulus we need to more
actively take care of our brain.

313
00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:41,680
Once we have these tools like
Neuromatch where we can assess

314
00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:46,160
your brain health, you can start
to tune your brain periodically

315
00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:48,520
to make sure let's go and
drifting off in the wrong

316
00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:50,280
direction.
Let's just put it back in the

317
00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:54,080
right place either through
behavioral changes like sleeping

318
00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:57,200
and eating better.
But if it goes a little bit

319
00:18:57,200 --> 00:19:00,680
beyond that, we could perhaps do
modulation kind of your brain

320
00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:04,480
function do use Wellness
products to bring it back to a

321
00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:07,360
more normal range.
And I think the future is more

322
00:19:07,360 --> 00:19:09,680
where you actively manage your
brain health.

323
00:19:10,120 --> 00:19:14,320
But also when you have a problem
now, it's more like the

324
00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:18,680
diagnosis is you talk to the
doctor, you take some MRI's,

325
00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:21,680
there's no obvious problem.
I don't know what to do.

326
00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:24,880
There's a lot of just guessing
going around where you go to

327
00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:27,680
multiple hospitals and you don't
even know exactly what your

328
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:30,920
problem is.
But Neuromatch now is able to

329
00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:35,360
give you an exact pinpoint it.
The whole point is, see the

330
00:19:35,360 --> 00:19:38,160
invisible just show you where
the problem is.

331
00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:41,640
And once we can show you the
problem is right there, it's no

332
00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:44,000
longer wondering what's
happening.

333
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:47,080
You know that the problem is in
this part of your brain where

334
00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:48,760
things are overactive, let's
say.

335
00:19:49,080 --> 00:19:53,360
And if that's clearly visualized
and pinpointed to a specific

336
00:19:53,360 --> 00:19:57,720
region, then all you have to do
is reverse that change, which

337
00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:01,320
will remove your symptoms.
That will be one way of

338
00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:04,800
diagnosing and then also pairing
that with treatment because

339
00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:07,560
accurate diagnosis is the same
as treatment.

340
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:11,520
When I explain about how we map
the brain and figure out the

341
00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:15,080
accurate diagnosis, a lot of
people ask me, diagnosis is

342
00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,000
great, but what about treatment?
But when you know exactly what

343
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:20,520
the problem is, the treatment is
the same as the diagnosis.

344
00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:23,080
If your car stops, let's say,
and you don't know why it

345
00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:24,760
stopped, it's a stopping
disease.

346
00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:27,240
But if you know that your car
stopped because your engine oil

347
00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:29,800
was depleted, that.
Hypnosis is the same as the

348
00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:32,080
treatment because you have to
refill the engine oil.

349
00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:36,400
Being able to pinpoint the
problem with the brain function

350
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:40,800
will open up a new Ave. for
understanding exactly what your

351
00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:45,040
problem is and then treating it.
And the approach is similar in

352
00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:46,800
all the different brain
disorders.

353
00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:50,040
It will have details that are
varying, but the whole point is

354
00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:54,080
that we want to normalize brain
function and that will be the

355
00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:57,840
beginning where we will see a
lot of patients that go through

356
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:02,880
neural match exams and then we
will try to reverse the disease

357
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:06,240
related changes.
But at the same time more into

358
00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:08,840
the future.
What I see is that all of us who

359
00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:13,080
feel still healthy, we should
start to monitor our brain

360
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:16,600
health, try to make sure it
doesn't go outside the range of

361
00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:19,760
normal function where you
continue to tune to make sure

362
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:24,160
things stay within the range.
And if it goes off, you start to

363
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:27,440
clip those changes, put it back
into the normal range so that

364
00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:31,280
you never become sick.
And is there one story or

365
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,600
example that you might be able
to share that might put this all

366
00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:38,720
together for us now that shows
this real world impact in real

367
00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:41,320
time for an individual?
Yeah.

368
00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:45,680
I mean, there has been multiple
cases where a lot of my friends

369
00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:50,240
who had family members with
severe neurological or

370
00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:53,840
psychiatric conditions where
they went to multiple hospitals,

371
00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:57,360
all the tests came back normal
and they didn't know what

372
00:21:57,360 --> 00:22:01,040
exactly the problem was.
But once we did the test with

373
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:04,720
neuromatch, we could figure out
pinpoint the problems in the

374
00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:07,960
brain that exactly matches the
symptoms.

375
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:10,080
The next treatment is very
clear.

376
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:13,000
However, those treatments are
not yet available in many of the

377
00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:16,280
hospital settings.
So what we have now decided to

378
00:22:16,280 --> 00:22:19,720
do is open a new clinic.
The clinic is called New Vera

379
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:23,880
Brain Health and we are going to
open that clinic early next

380
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:25,800
year, January, February
timeline.

381
00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:29,080
And that's where we're going to
bring back all the people we

382
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,240
were able to exactly diagnose
what their problem is, matching

383
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:36,600
their symptoms to also work with
them to have treatments.

384
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:40,560
And I'm very excited about that.
Thank you so much for sharing

385
00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:42,080
that.
We'll be sure to include some

386
00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:46,120
additional information from you
that people can grab in the show

387
00:22:46,120 --> 00:22:48,160
notes below.
Thank you.

388
00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:52,320
It's getting close to closing
time and we have a special way

389
00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:55,840
that we close up our sessions
and Crystal will be asking you

390
00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:59,040
some questions very shortly.
But I do have one more question

391
00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:03,600
about you alluded to the future
of the neuromatch system.

392
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:09,000
So say a decade from now, 20
years from now, what is your

393
00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:14,120
belief that will this be used in
primary care, neurologic care,

394
00:23:14,120 --> 00:23:18,240
psychiatric care?
Where do you see neuromats being

395
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:23,360
used in the healthcare system?
I think it should be utilized in

396
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:27,000
every stage of care.
We have ways of providing more

397
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:28,960
detailed information.
Let's say if you're a

398
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,840
neurosurgeon or somebody who
needs to do a very precise

399
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:34,320
procedure.
But the basic level of

400
00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:38,240
monitoring should be done all
the way from primary care to

401
00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:42,600
actual surgical units.
I envision that all of the above

402
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:47,120
should be adopting this
technology that allows you to

403
00:23:47,360 --> 00:23:52,120
monitor brain health.
And in the future, what I hope

404
00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:56,720
is that by doing that kind of
preventative care, nobody really

405
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,960
will have neurological or
psychiatric disorders.

406
00:23:59,960 --> 00:24:03,240
More that we're always treating
ourselves to make sure we never

407
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,960
become sick.
That's my hopes and dreams.

408
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,800
I think we're all hoping for the
future where we can talk more

409
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,720
openly about brain health, what
that looks like in the ways that

410
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,480
we can take care of our brains
together.

411
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:21,320
Which leads me to the rapid fire
question part for our guests.

412
00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,000
Just some quick questions so we
can give our listeners some

413
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:30,280
actual steps from your brilliant
brain as an expert in your own

414
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:33,680
area of expertise but has
entered into the brain health

415
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:37,640
and Wellness space.
What your one non negotiable for

416
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:41,640
taking care of your own brain?
If I had to pick one, it's

417
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:45,040
sleeping.
I think everybody would agree

418
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,680
that sleeping is really
important for your brain health.

419
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:51,520
I can actually feel it.
We also see it in our various

420
00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:55,120
patient data.
Not sleeping is perhaps the

421
00:24:55,120 --> 00:24:56,880
worst thing you can do to your
brain.

422
00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:00,360
So if I had to pick one, it'll
definitely be sleeping.

423
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,280
Yes, I think that's one that was
underrated for many years and we

424
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:07,440
realized we really missed the
public health messaging over the

425
00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:10,920
past decade or so and we are
course directing in that one.

426
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:16,000
How do the listeners find out
more about you and or follow

427
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,840
your work?
I have many websites for

428
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:23,080
Stanford.
I have my lab website, Lee Lab

429
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:29,080
Neuromatch is also introduced in
elviscorp.com and also new Vera

430
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:33,720
Health Institute is explained in
new vera.org.

431
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,160
But also we're starting a new
website to bring a lot of

432
00:25:37,360 --> 00:25:42,400
knowledge to the general public,
a new website calledginbrain.com

433
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:45,960
and that will was it Com I don't
remember.

434
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,560
It's a website where we're going
to put a lot of knowledge that

435
00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:52,400
the general public can engage
and learn about brain health.

436
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:56,160
That's great.
We'll be sure to snag all those

437
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:59,320
websites and they'll be below in
the show notes for our listeners

438
00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:01,520
to grab.
And when I'm sure you have the

439
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:04,440
final word though, today, what
message do you want our

440
00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:08,000
listeners to take away about the
power of understanding their

441
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,560
brains, either for human health
or for innovation today?

442
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:17,120
I think knowledge of the brain,
even though it may not have been

443
00:26:17,120 --> 00:26:21,160
directly to understand the
brain, we always as we grow up

444
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:23,920
and learn more about everything
over time.

445
00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:27,320
The one thing that you should
learn the most about is yourself

446
00:26:28,120 --> 00:26:31,880
and knowing the brain beyond
just knowing yourself and your

447
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:35,800
character really will open up a
lot of possibilities for

448
00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:38,360
everyone.
I think you can look forward to

449
00:26:38,360 --> 00:26:40,120
the day and age of knowing your
brain.

450
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:44,520
What an inspiring conversation
we've had today with the notion,

451
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:47,560
in the words that I at least
clung on to was the idea that we

452
00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:51,560
can see the invisible with the
data that we can get from our

453
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:54,000
own brains.
Your work reminds us that the

454
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:57,640
future of brain health isn't
only about smarter technology,

455
00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:01,440
it's about using innovation to
better understand ourselves.

456
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:05,440
Neuromax shows what's possible
when neuroscience, technology,

457
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:08,400
and imagination come together
for better brain health.

458
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:12,720
Doctor Jin Lee, thank you so
much for letting us pick your

459
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:15,640
brilliant brain on the Let's
Talk Brain Health Podcast.

460
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:20,040
Thank you for investing your
time and energy into your

461
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:23,560
personal brain care by listening
to today's episode of the Let's

462
00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:26,960
Talk Brain Health Podcast.
I hope our conversation gave you

463
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,720
fresh insights, a bit of
infiration, or practical steps

464
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:33,960
that you can take on your own
personal brain care journey.

465
00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:37,280
If you enjoyed today's
conversation, I'd like to ask

466
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:40,160
you to please share this episode
with someone who could benefit

467
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:42,640
from it or consider leaving us a
review.

468
00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:46,400
If you have questions or a topic
in brain health you'd like me to

469
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:50,320
explore, please e-mail me
anytime at podcast at

470
00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:54,040
virtualbrightonhealthcenter.com.
I'd love to hear from you.

471
00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:58,320
We have so many more exciting
topics ahead, and I can't wait

472
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,320
to continue this lifelong
journey of better brain health

473
00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:04,440
together with you and our
growing virtual community.

474
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,120
Until next time, remember to
give your brain the care it

475
00:28:08,120 --> 00:28:11,320
deserves and make your brain
health a priority.